You are going in the right direction, Rudy. On the clip I heard, there was good snare dynamics going on, and you nailed a couple of phrases.
MethodAir
Ok thanks peter. Today shall be a day I don'r forget. This is the most honest feedback I've ever heard about my playing. Truth hurts, but it's all good . [img]graemlins/thumbs_up.gif[/img]
You are going in the right direction, Rudy. On the clip I heard, there was good snare dynamics going on, and you nailed a couple of phrases.
MethodAir
Thanks Methodair. My whole inspiration for making a recording was based on your sound and your solo, the one at the start of this thread. I guess it's back to the practise pad for me. [img]smile.gif[/img]
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Rudy, please don't get dispondant mate, your comments about yourself were pretty harsh. Playing any musical instrument is a massive learning curve and we will never be as good as we would like as there will always be something that is beyond our reach.You're right dazzler, completely. It wasn't a proper or musical solo, not a solo at all actually. I just let the minidisc run, and played things, but theres nothing cohesive. Truth is, I wish I hadn't posted anything now. It's all shit, and i was under a false illusion that it actually sounded good. I have a lot to learn. still
You obviously have more chops than you will ever need as far as I can tell, I just wasn't sure of the intent behind that clip.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Solos can take on many forms and one thing they shouldn't be (as far as I'm concerned) is simply a 'display of chops'. If it is then we're getting into the realms of all that 'who can play the fastest' bullsh1t which has nothing to do with anything.Solos basically are a bunch of chops aren't they? I've been listening to a few solos recently, and they have much the same thing, where there's not much structure, just things happening randomly, a sort of freeform solo. Then there's the steve gadd type solo which is very structured and rhytmic. Aren't they both valid?
When you sit down to record yourself next, think of what you intend to accomplish in your solo. You're right, Gadd will always have a reference point of some sort in his head. Try to sing a tune in your head or out loud as you play, this will instantly give you and the listener a sense of form. Change sounds/timbres for the bridge section and try to make contrasts.
Use the melody to play off, this is a good place to start as it will feed your ideas and give you a reference point. Max Roach was a master at this and you can clearly hear the melody as he solos round the form. Joey Baron again is fantastic and won't be afraid to play the shape of the melody exactly on the drums. It's not an easy route to take as it is all about phrasing and being as musical and as true as possible (for me anyway).
You could play a groove and see where that takes you. Don't feel obliged to play 4 bars and them simply go off one one and fly round the kit. Let the groove you're playing expand, sing a bass line to yourself, imaging there is a guitarist standing next to you. How would that influence your ideas?
If you DO want to play a free form solo then never be afraid to leave plenty of space. Sometimes we drummers feel oblidged to treat solos as an excuse to get it all out and create a wall of sound. This more times than not just sounds like a fire in a pet shop!
Play a simple rhythmic idea, it could be three notes. Stop, play it again, then play it on different surfaces. How does this change the sound? Play it again, expand on it. Pause, think about what you want to do with it next.... you get the idea. This will make you think about what you are creating instead of letting your hands do what they naturally want to do. For the audience this is great to as they can hear your thought process and ideas without being bombarded straight away. When listening back, you will (hopefully) find this much more musical and gratifying than hearing yourself play stuff that you know you can already do.
It's a hard topic and there are many many different ways to treat a drum solo. It could be open, over a vamp, trading 4' or 8's, playing over the whole form of a tune... the main thing that is important no matter what the circumstance is to be musical at all times. Think of the context that the solo is in. What was played before you started the solo? Could that perhaps have an influence on what you will play?
Ditch the ego and use it as an opportunity to play and create something that you've never played before, to create a new piece of music. Challenge yourself. Have fun and please don't beat yourself up about posting on here. This is a friendly forum and all the guys here are more than positive generally, you're amongst friends! I would say that you certainly don't need any more technique you sound like you have great facility, it just needs to be directed a little.
Good luck!
Dazzler,
That is an awesome post you just made! It does make sense to structure, and to think musically, rather than random chops which, as you quite rightly say, have no direction. Ego aside, I do really like the sound of some of the chops I did, but yeah, they don't really go anywhere. I also really hate some of the chops I tried that didn't come off. Anyway, I won't give up, and I will post recordings again, because at least you and a few others now know how (badly) I play, so let's see if I can come up with something more flowing. [img]biggrin.gif[/img]
Just on the point of groove mixed with a few chops, what is your opinion then of stuff4? Nicely structured with groove but badly played/executed, or complete crap? Is stuff4 more the kind of thing you think I should do, since it's groove based? Perhaps build on that groove more? Thanks again Dazzler for taking the time. [img]smile.gif[/img]
Rudy,
Let me ask you what you could say
about someone's playing, with the
samples that you posted, if it were
not you but someone else?
You cannot take our comments about
these small samples, with too heavy
a hand. If you really want drummers
here to evaluate you, try and put
something together, much like what
Dazz is looking for.
A structure of some kind always helps
to bring out the groove in a drummer
and how you choose to cut it up, will
tell us about the technique that you
may have and employ - especially HOW
you use it is key.
Another thing to remember is that it
may take a while for someone to get
to your files. They may not hear them
for days or even weeks because of
whatever reason. If there's no immed-
iate response, don't let that worry
you. People are busy. It's not that
they think nothing of you.
The person most important that you
need to consult about your sound is
you. It all starts there.
I would be interested to hear you
play to some tune of other. Do you
have any recent recordings? Can you
do a play-along to give us an idea?
That will help us help you, with
REAL feedback. Snippets just tell a
little story and you seem to want
more than that. So, supply us with
something. Sounds like you have the
set-up there. Go for it.
Again, always stay positive and be
open to ideas but based on inform-
ation provided. If we haven't heard
you, what we say only holds so much
water. You know what I mean?
[img]cool.gif[/img]
For Rudy,
It all boils down to this. No one in the music industry really gives a hoot about drum solos. It's all about playing music with a group. Of course there are some exceptions, Collins and Bozzio.
But the bad thing is that drums solos are so much fun for us drummers! So when you plan on soloing, picture a dance floor of people dancing to a beat. Keep them on the floor. Make sure you can clap your hands to what you are playing. You must have a tempo and pulse that remains, unless you use actual ritardondos or accerlerandos as a compositonal tool. If you can't keep the dance floor filled---you have failed. If it's not in time, then it's not in time and it doesn't mean squat.
BTW, I haven't listened to your clips yet, but from what I read, this may help.
Peace
<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ February 18, 2004 04:36 PM: Message edited by: FlamTriplet ]</font>
Guys I believe it was completly wrong to critisize so badly rudy's playing. And not because I believe you always should be nice and not be honest, but because of the simple reason that what he wanted to show was completly well executed. His sound is great and the licks he was trying were completly accurate.
I've never seen anybody being so harsh with somebody's playing in this forum, and I've seen people that play much worse than rudy's get great feedback.
I myself liked a lot the way the licks flowed and I wouldn't be able to find any mistake in the things played. Perhaps rudy you should just record a solo in which you incorporate more groove ideas in between the licks and give a more musical structure to it so you can demostrate he board your level of playing wich I believe is very good.
Anyways I strongly critisize the attitude of the posters, never seen before, and I've been reading this board since years.... [img]graemlins/thumbs_down.gif[/img]
Besides he never said he had the intentions of creating the ultimate musical drum solo of ever, he just wanted to show some licks, why is then than everybody is being so exigent??, what he wanted to show was some licks and his sound, he recorded a couple of things fast you shouldn't expect something carefully planned to amaze the world.
"Was ''''just messing around'''' with a mixer and some mics today in my kitchen. Just a couple of soundbites of '''something I'm trying to get together'''. They're really short, sorry. Will try and put something longer together soon.
damn this makes me mad [img]mad.gif[/img]
<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ February 18, 2004 05:02 PM: Message edited by: Manu11 ]</font>
Did I miss something Manu? I don't see anyone being harsh with him.
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